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 The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?

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Hippocampus
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PostSubject: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:46 am

Coming out in Next Challengers/The New Challengers:



Lore: Tribute 1 face-up Level 5 or higher Normal Summoned monster you control, then target 1 face-up card on the field; negate its effects, then draw 1 card. This negation lasts until the end of this turn. You can banish this card from your Graveyard, then declare 1 Attribute; all face-up monsters on the field become that Attribute until the end of this turn.

The first effect is obviously decent in Monarch-type decks, but the second effect is what peaked my interest. It's complete field attribute manipulation that isn't continuous (thus isn't susceptible to MST and the like), and you don't need to run a Level 5 or higher monster at all to use it. You don't even need to worry if it's discarded or milled, since its effect activates in the graveyard like A/D Changer.

Does this sound like something Charmer users can try to improve their plays? Discuss.

_________________
Quotes:
Quote :
[19:31:10 25/01/14] Corrupted Charmer, Y : We opened a new world
Quote :
[07:24:14] Runo : "The day when Hippocampus joined Charmers Community, he also lost his precious sleep time for sure."

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hiita lover
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Mon Jul 21, 2014 4:46 pm

I might try it out. It's not a bad card.


EDIT: I did try it on DN. It's a good card but I still like scroll of bewitchment a lot better.
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Hippocampus
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:51 pm

Yeah, the good thing about Scroll is that it's searchable, but this card is harder to counter. What kinds of opponents did you play against, hiita lover?

I also completely forgot about Blizzard Princess + this cool!

_________________
Quotes:
Quote :
[19:31:10 25/01/14] Corrupted Charmer, Y : We opened a new world
Quote :
[07:24:14] Runo : "The day when Hippocampus joined Charmers Community, he also lost his precious sleep time for sure."

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hiita lover
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:28 am

I play against HAT (Hand Artifact Traptrix) Mermails Dark world FAT(Fire fist Hand Traptrix) & Lightsworn. And yet I beat all of those deck with my charmer deck. I hate lightsworn. The monarch's thunder is a good card. Don't forget about Laval Chain as you can dump the monarchs thunder to the graveyard.
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Eria
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Thu Jul 24, 2014 1:01 am

Hippocampus wrote:
and you don't need to run a Level 5 or higher monster at all to use it.
Of course, but having it discarded or milled to activate it from grave just make it even more conditional than DNA Transplant and Scroll of Bewitchment.

This card is just more conditional than DNA and Scroll since it needs to hit grave, and Charmer deck in general already have inconsistencies by themselves. If you want to change opp monster's attribute to have it controlled by Charmer, DNA and Scroll is a more flexible option compared to this card.

Charmonarch is the only deck I can think works best with this card. But even so, I see it nothing more as a tech, and you still can replace it with better card.

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Hippocampus
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:13 pm

Eria wrote:
Of course, but having it discarded or milled to activate it from grave just make it even more conditional than DNA Transplant and Scroll of Bewitchment.

This card is just more conditional than DNA and Scroll since it needs to hit grave, and Charmer deck in general already have inconsistencies by themselves. If you want to change opp monster's attribute to have it controlled by Charmer, DNA and Scroll is a more flexible option compared to this card.
Having a discard outlet can be very useful, because it allows you to run stuff like Cursed Seal of the Forbidden Spell/Divine Wrath/PWWB/Summoner Monk/other things without fear. And considering that some Charmer decks run A/D Changer who activates in the same way, I'd think they can certainly make room for this card. No more conditional, I'd think Smile

Hell, this gives me an idea to make a Turbo Charmers... brb

_________________
Quotes:
Quote :
[19:31:10 25/01/14] Corrupted Charmer, Y : We opened a new world
Quote :
[07:24:14] Runo : "The day when Hippocampus joined Charmers Community, he also lost his precious sleep time for sure."

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Eria
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:09 pm

Remember this thing only change attribute for 1 turn. If you're not going to play Lv 5 or higher and just want to change opponent's monster's attribute, just use Scroll of Bewitchment.

Sometimes when you confident with your backrow, you don't want to send your Charmer and the controlled monster to grave to summon the FP yet. This card forces you to immediately summon the FP. Less flexibility. Besides, x3 Scroll of Bewitchment plus DNA Transplant aren't enough? There's already a lot of -1 like Waboku/Roar and you still want to run Cursed Seal/Divine Wrath/PWWB? lol. A/D at least can block an attack then function as Book of Taiyou later.

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Hippocampus
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:29 pm

Eria wrote:
Sometimes when you confident with your backrow, you don't want to send your Charmer and the controlled monster to grave to summon the FP yet. This card forces you to immediately summon the FP.
Er... no it doesn't?
I'm pretty sure you can banish this card from your Graveyard whenever turn you want, not only the turn it's sent there. So you can just set up your grave over time, and then when you're ready to go for a FP-play, just use it then.

Eria wrote:
Besides, x3 Scroll of Bewitchment plus DNA Transplant aren't enough?
Well it does depend on your build, but I wouldn't run DNA Transplant and this in the same deck. DNA Transplant is better for if you're running a deck with your favorite Charmer, while this card looks better if you're running multiple Charmers. So it's all a matter of preference.

Eria wrote:
A/D at least can block an attack then function as Book of Taiyou later.
I never said A/D wasn't better than this. I just said they both activate the same way. If you have both in your Graveyard, that's basically a one-turn FP right there XD

_________________
Quotes:
Quote :
[19:31:10 25/01/14] Corrupted Charmer, Y : We opened a new world
Quote :
[07:24:14] Runo : "The day when Hippocampus joined Charmers Community, he also lost his precious sleep time for sure."

Suspicious Spoiler:
 
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Eria
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:12 am

Hippocampus wrote:
Eria wrote:
Sometimes when you confident with your backrow, you don't want to send your Charmer and the controlled monster to grave to summon the FP yet. This card forces you to immediately summon the FP.
Er... no it doesn't?
I'm pretty sure you can banish this card from your Graveyard whenever turn you want, not only the turn it's sent there. So you can just set up your grave over time, and then when you're ready to go for a FP-play, just use it then.

Tell me where I state it can't be used the turn where it is sent. You're missing the point. Read again please?

Hippocampus wrote:
Eria wrote:
Besides, x3 Scroll of Bewitchment plus DNA Transplant aren't enough?
Well it does depend on your build, but I wouldn't run DNA Transplant and this in the same deck. DNA Transplant is better for if you're running a deck with your favorite Charmer, while this card looks better if you're running multiple Charmers. So it's all a matter of preference.
Of course, if x3 Scroll is enough why ever you want to run this card too, since Scroll is more flexible. Why use a card that less flexible and less conditional then? When preference matters, its only when we're talking about the build with Lv 5 or higher monster. Other than that, using this without Lv 5 or higher is just bad. Dead way too often.

Hippocampus wrote:
Eria wrote:
A/D at least can block an attack then function as Book of Taiyou later.
I never said A/D wasn't better than this. I just said they both activate the same way. If you have both in your Graveyard, that's basically a one-turn FP right there XD
You're missing the point again. They did activate in same way, but you can't set a spell card on monster zone to block an attack. A/D is a monster. It can be sent to graveyard easier than this card.
Hippocampus wrote:
considering that some Charmer decks run A/D Changer who activates in the same way, I'd think they can certainly make room for this card.
So if they can make room for A/D doesn't mean they can make room for this. This card dead more often than A/D since it's a spell that needs to hit grave, except if we're talking about a build w/ lv 5 or higher.

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hiita lover
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:03 pm

You can used Laval chain to dump this card to the graveyard then used the effect of this card to take a monster of you have a charmer monster set. BTW you can used this card Graveyard effect anytime you want. A/D changer is not a good card because it's a book of taiyou and book of taiyou is not a good card for a charmer deck. It's not a dead card in your hand it's good bait for your opponent's MST. So it will hit the graveyard.
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Sat Jul 26, 2014 3:30 am

Lavalval Chain is good option to send this card, but only if you already have a Charmer ready to be flipped that turn, since most of time there's better option to Xyz rank 4. If only there's a way to send spell as easy as using Mathematician, this card would be so much better.

I'm talking about Charmer Deck that doesn't even run high lv monster but still want to run this card when other attribute changer card that provides more consistency exists.

A/D Changer and Book of Taiyou is not good, I agree. Those are better replaced with better card. A/D and Book dead less often, whereas this card is still a dead card in your hand if you don't use lv 5 or higher or discard outlet, having opponent to use MST to it is far too conditional and not everyone run MST (especially if we're talking about the competitive gameplay since the existence of Artifacts and Shaddolls, those decks don't mind getting hit by MST). When they use MST, they still can hit your other backrow and if it's still facedown on the field, it's now harder to be sent to grave since there's no way you can discard it. It won't always be sent to grave when its set, and you relied on your own luck for your opponent to hit it. Remember consistency is important in deckbuilding.

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hiita lover
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:25 am

Yes consistency is important for making a good deck but charmers are already a inconsist deck. Why would I make a Inconsist deck consistent? You can run Level 5 or higher monsters in your charmer deck if you want. To make this card more live. All of the FP forms except FP Dharc does nothing. All the FP are a -2 to even bring them to the field. At least FP dharc lets you add lyna to your hand. Even with that they all do nothing. A card that does priceing battle damage is a bad card in todays game. All of the FP forms does nothing when they are in the field. At least Gemini has a effect when they are normal summon again. With the FP forms they don't do nothing at all. They are 1850 normal monster that can get brakethrough skill and effect Viler and Friendish chain.
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:44 am

hiita lover wrote:
Yes consistency is important for making a good deck but charmers are already a inconsist deck. Why would I make a Inconsist deck consistent?
> Charmers already inconsistent
> Add more inconsistent card to the deck
> Deck success rate % reduced

O.k

hiita lover wrote:
You can run Level 5 or higher monsters in your charmer deck if you want. To make this card more live.
Exactly. The best use of this card is to put it in a build that can make it dead less often.

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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:04 am

hiita lover wrote:
Why would I make a Inconsist deck consistent?

wow

*steps back*



wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow
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Hippocampus
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Sun Jul 27, 2014 12:42 pm

hiita lover wrote:
All of the FP forms except FP Dharc does nothing. All the FP are a -2 to even bring them to the field. At least FP dharc lets you add lyna to your hand. Even with that they all do nothing. A card that does priceing battle damage is a bad card in todays game. All of the FP forms does nothing when they are in the field. At least Gemini has a effect when they are normal summon again. With the FP forms they don't do nothing at all.
This response makes you sound like you hate Charmer decks... Remember, the FP forms don't "do nothing". They can attack, and they can run over most Level 4 or lower monsters, and considering that you win the game by battle damage... you shouldn't say they do nothing Wink Also piercing can be more useful than you think.

hiita lover wrote:
They are 1850 normal monster that can get brakethrough skill and effect Viler and Friendish chain.
I'm sorry, but I would NEVER waste a Breakthrough Skill or an Effect Veiler on a Familiar-Possessed monster lol

_________________
Quotes:
Quote :
[19:31:10 25/01/14] Corrupted Charmer, Y : We opened a new world
Quote :
[07:24:14] Runo : "The day when Hippocampus joined Charmers Community, he also lost his precious sleep time for sure."

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hiita lover
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:14 pm

Oh you would used fiendish chain on a FP monster. BTW I don't hate charmer decks. But it's true. The Charmer monster are cute and have awesome artwork but they are useless in a duel.
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ally of justice catastor
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:01 am

then Hiita, you never see me play my Genex Charmer deck, I managed to PWned some deck with them and laugh at how embarrassed they are (^^^)

_________________

Hikigaya Hachiman wrote:
In other words, those who are shunned are the ones who are closest to the gods, and if we shift this perspective around, can we not consider them as proof of those who have surpassed the human realm?

Quote :
[13:19:57] ally of justice catastor : and that day, Catastor have made his own religious
[13:20:29] Hippocampus : and we all followed him as our disciple and messiah

Seitokai no Ichizon wrote:
“A power level of nine trillion eighty thousand isn’t just for show…… Mafuyu…… Mafuyu’s power level would probably be about negative thirty seven……”
“What do you mean it’s negative?!”
“Mafuyu is defeated by Mafuyu’s opponent easily without them having to do anything. And then Mafuyu is nursed back to health by them.”
“That definitely makes it negative!”
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Hippocampus
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Name: Theodore Tsakiris
HP:
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MP:
200/200  (200/200)

PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:06 am

hiita lover wrote:
Oh you would used fiendish chain on a FP monster. BTW I don't hate charmer decks. But it's true. The Charmer monster are cute and have awesome artwork but they are useless in a duel.
Yes I would use Fiendish Chain on a FP monster, because it also stops the monster from attacking.

ally of justice catastor wrote:
then Hiita, you never see me play my Genex Charmer deck, I managed to PWned some deck with them and laugh at how embarrassed they are (^^^)
Back to the OT, catastor what are your thoughts on this card?

_________________
Quotes:
Quote :
[19:31:10 25/01/14] Corrupted Charmer, Y : We opened a new world
Quote :
[07:24:14] Runo : "The day when Hippocampus joined Charmers Community, he also lost his precious sleep time for sure."

Suspicious Spoiler:
 
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ΛΔ
Junior Charmer
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PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Mon Jul 28, 2014 11:16 pm

I agree with hiita lover that Charmers are awful as cards (not bottom of the barrel, but pretty damn close), but still.

You don't want to make an inconsistent deck even more inconsistent. You want to max consistency as best as possible. Because inconsistent decks don't have the luxury get bad draws and such near as much as consistent decks do.
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ally of justice catastor
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150/150  (150/150)

PostSubject: Re: The Monarchs Thunder - New Charmer support card?   Tue Jul 29, 2014 12:43 am

Hippo wrote:
Back to the OT, catastor what are your thoughts on this card?

not bad, could be used for some times, but it won't really work from what I see, its just too inconsistent

_________________

Hikigaya Hachiman wrote:
In other words, those who are shunned are the ones who are closest to the gods, and if we shift this perspective around, can we not consider them as proof of those who have surpassed the human realm?

Quote :
[13:19:57] ally of justice catastor : and that day, Catastor have made his own religious
[13:20:29] Hippocampus : and we all followed him as our disciple and messiah

Seitokai no Ichizon wrote:
“A power level of nine trillion eighty thousand isn’t just for show…… Mafuyu…… Mafuyu’s power level would probably be about negative thirty seven……”
“What do you mean it’s negative?!”
“Mafuyu is defeated by Mafuyu’s opponent easily without them having to do anything. And then Mafuyu is nursed back to health by them.”
“That definitely makes it negative!”
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